Forums: Rules Questions: Nanocyte Questions! (2024)

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captain yesterday Sep 19, 2021, 06:47 am

I feel like I'm going to be coming back to this often, with all sorts of questions!

First of all, great job! Looks like a ton of fun!

First question! Can you use your major forms to create armor? Examples in the gear array description only mention weapons and cybernetic augmentations.

B) Do your nanites form all the major and minor forms all at once, or is it as you need the item it's just there.

BretI Sep 26, 2021, 04:34 pm

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Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I do not think you can take armor as a form based on the wording and all the other issues that would bring up such as environmental protections and armor upgrade slots.

Gear array wrote:

Major forms include weapons and cybernetic augmentations; minor forms include technological items (excluding armor and weapons) and personal items.

Major forms are specifically limited to weapons and cybernetic augmentations. Armor is neither of those. Minor forms specifically excludes armor.

My reading is that you create one piece of gear with your gear array. It uses the singular form when describing creating an item.

Wesrolter Sep 26, 2021, 05:43 pm

No to the armour, as standard it will be one item at a time without a special ability.

Toxicsyn Oct 19, 2021, 07:12 am

Does Swarmstrike work with the Improved Unarmed Strike feat?

Xenocrat Oct 19, 2021, 01:43 pm

Yes.

Toxicsyn Oct 21, 2021, 10:22 am

Could you use Gear Array to create weapons made from special materials? For example, could you use Gear Array to create a Cold Iron Tactical Dashko as one of your major forms at level 1?

captain yesterday Oct 30, 2021, 06:45 am

BretI wrote:

I do not think you can take armor as a form based on the wording and all the other issues that would bring up such as environmental protections and armor upgrade slots.

Gear array wrote:

Major forms include weapons and cybernetic augmentations; minor forms include technological items (excluding armor and weapons) and personal items.

Major forms are specifically limited to weapons and cybernetic augmentations. Armor is neither of those. Minor forms specifically excludes armor.

My reading is that you create one piece of gear with your gear array. It uses the singular form when describing creating an item.

Thank you! In hindsight I should have read a bit deeper as the sheath array is pretty much your armor array.

Flames of Chaos Dec 14, 2021, 07:06 pm

How long do items formed from your gear array last outside combat - if at all - before you have to burn nanite surges to switch/use them? It seems like one of three possibilities:

1. They just don't - this seems silly since minor forms exist at all, but I can see an argument for that interpretation.
2. They do, but it's only for 10 min. or however long it takes to burn a resolve point to regain stamina.
3. They stay formed in that form until you burn a move action in combat or give an order out of combat to reform/close them down/long rest for the day.

Do any of these seem right? I'm still grappling with the concept myself.

Milo v3 Dec 14, 2021, 07:17 pm

Gear Arrays aren't tied to combat to begin with, so I'm unsure what you are talking about.

Quote:

The nanites maintain their array until you direct

them into a different array, you fall unconscious, or you end
your turn more than 10 feet from the array.

You also don't need to spend nanite surges to change unless you're changing them as a swift action.

E-div_drone Dec 16, 2021, 05:54 pm

Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Toxicsyn wrote:

Could you use Gear Array to create weapons made from special materials? For example, could you use Gear Array to create a Cold Iron Tactical Dashko as one of your major forms at level 1?

Shockingly, there is nothing in the rules for special materials, either in the CRB on page 191, or in the Armory, starting on page 66, that say you can't create them out of UPBs. Since that is the same effect for how a Nanocyte creates their gear, I see no reason, RAW, that they shouldn't be able to create an item out of special materials, though your GM might want to increase the effective item level for some of the materials, as they can provide a significantly increased effect for the same supposed item level.

Forums: Rules Questions: Nanocyte Questions! (14) Unseelie Jan 18, 2022, 01:42 pm

Here's another Nanocyte question.

For major gear array, there's nothing that specifically says you can't make non-powered melee weapons (note, it doesn't say you can either but analog was not excluded). It just doesn't make sense to me that I could create a laser pistol, but can't create a dagger.

I ask, because Hero Lab Online implemented it as only powered melee weapons... and based on previous experience , short of Paizo telling them they're wrong they're just going to get defensive and say it's implemented as written.

Milo v3 Jan 18, 2022, 02:30 pm

You are correct, they made that up. No such restriction exists.

The only limit is the standard major form limitations + that it has to be technological, not magical or hybrid.

Forums: Rules Questions: Nanocyte Questions! (17) Unseelie Jan 18, 2022, 06:36 pm

Mathias answered me on the LWD forums, this is what he said:

Quote:

This is the combination of rules that led us to the decision to exclude the analog property.

CRB pg 180, in Analog: 'It is immune to abilities that target technology"

TR pg 10: "weapons and items must be technological items (not magic or hybrid),"

An official yes or no would be grand, but I know how I'm house ruling it for my game. It does make HLO slightly less useful for me though.

JiCi Jan 19, 2022, 05:36 am

captain yesterday wrote:

First question! Can you use your major forms to create armor? Examples in the gear array description only mention weapons and cybernetic augmentations.

B) Do your nanites form all the major and minor forms all at once, or is it as you need the item it's just there.

Non and no

It's like the biggest problem with the class... You cannot form armor upgrades and there's no way to form 2 or more forms per gear array, so you're stuck juggling items with different item levels.

Forums: Rules Questions: Nanocyte Questions! (20) Unseelie Jan 22, 2022, 07:22 pm

JiCi wrote:

captain yesterday wrote:

First question! Can you use your major forms to create armor? Examples in the gear array description only mention weapons and cybernetic augmentations.

B) Do your nanites form all the major and minor forms all at once, or is it as you need the item it's just there.

Non and no

It's like the biggest problem with the class... You cannot form armor upgrades and there's no way to form 2 or more forms per gear array, so you're stuck juggling items with different item levels.

Perhaps another roundabout way of getting this answered short of it getting a FAQ entry...

Are there published Nanocyte stat blocks in any published books?

JiCi Jan 25, 2022, 01:50 am

Unseelie wrote:

JiCi wrote:

captain yesterday wrote:

First question! Can you use your major forms to create armor? Examples in the gear array description only mention weapons and cybernetic augmentations.

B) Do your nanites form all the major and minor forms all at once, or is it as you need the item it's just there.

Non and no

It's like the biggest problem with the class... You cannot form armor upgrades and there's no way to form 2 or more forms per gear array, so you're stuck juggling items with different item levels.

Perhaps another roundabout way of getting this answered short of it getting a FAQ entry...

Are there published Nanocyte stat blocks in any published books?

It's clearly written that you can form only ONE item per Gear Array. You can have up to 3 Gear Arrays, but the 2nd and 3rd ones use lower level items

Quote:

At 15th level, you can split your array into three forms simultaneously: a primary form using your full level to calculate its effects, a secondary form using your level – 4, and a tertiary form using your level – 8. / At 19th level, the effective level of your secondary nanite array increases to your level – 2, and the effective level of your tertiary nanite array increases to your level – 4.

Like I said, there is no Nanocyte feat that would allow it to form TWO items per array. Since you cannot have more than one item per Gear Array, there isn't room to use TWO major form slots for a more powerful item, like Armor Upgrades, such as a Forcepack.

This is something I've been complaining about during the playtests: the Gear Array is supposed to turn you into that futuristic Swiss Army Knife, but you can't do that, and you have to CHEAT. A Polyclub or Polylash can cover all 3 damage types. The Polyhand as a Minor Form can cover NINE tools, which also brings me to a new absent feature: you cannot convert 2 or 3 Minor Forms into a Major Form.

Wesrolter Jan 25, 2022, 03:39 am

One thing that was missed by the looks, there is 1 Knack to get 2 items for the price of one, but only for a double of the same operative or small arms weapon. Split Manifestation will allow you to have 2 of the same laser pistol if thats one of your forms.

JiCi Jan 25, 2022, 05:28 am

Wesrolter wrote:

One thing that was missed by the looks, there is 1 Knack to get 2 items for the price of one, but only for a double of the same operative or small arms weapon. Split Manifestation will allow you to have 2 of the same laser pistol if thats one of your forms.

I was aware of that, but this is the problem here.

A Major Form is not just a weapon. It can also be a cybernetic implant or technological item... that you might need to optimize your weapon. Since you cannot form more than 1 form per Gear Array, you have to settle for that item at one level and the weapon at another level.

The whole purpose of the Nanocyte is that you have a class that doesn't rely on "external hardware" to get around situations. However, it's so limited that it just comes out as a gimmick. The Gear Array has been pushed a LOT as the main feature of the Nanocyte, perhaps more than the Sheath and Cloud Arrays, yet it comes out of the weakest of them all.

The Nanocyte shouldn't need to manufactured weapons or tools. It should be able to whip out several forms at once at a decent level and mix and match. I can go as far as saying that Swarm Strike (available for the Sheath Array) should have been following the same damage progression as the Solarian Weapon, if a Nanocyte doesn't want to use the Gear Array.

Dracomicron Jan 25, 2022, 05:58 am

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JiCi wrote:

I can go as far as saying that Swarm Strike (available for the Sheath Array) should have been following the same damage progression as the Solarian Weapon, if a Nanocyte doesn't want to use the Gear Array.

Being an unarmed strike, Swarm Strike is already hideously competitive with the small investment of the Improved Unarmed Strike feat.

I don't think it needs Solar Weapon scaling.

JiCi Jan 25, 2022, 12:42 pm

Dracomicron wrote:

JiCi wrote:

I can go as far as saying that Swarm Strike (available for the Sheath Array) should have been following the same damage progression as the Solarian Weapon, if a Nanocyte doesn't want to use the Gear Array.

Being an unarmed strike, Swarm Strike is already hideously competitive with the small investment of the Improved Unarmed Strike feat.

I don't think it needs Solar Weapon scaling.

I knew about it, but you need a feat to optimize that knack.

I dunno, when you need feats to make a clas feature decent, I sense a problem...

Xenocrat Jan 25, 2022, 02:21 pm

It's a selectable class feature. Plenty of those can't be made decent with any amount of investment.

Garretmander Jan 25, 2022, 04:37 pm

JiCi wrote:

Dracomicron wrote:

JiCi wrote:

I can go as far as saying that Swarm Strike (available for the Sheath Array) should have been following the same damage progression as the Solarian Weapon, if a Nanocyte doesn't want to use the Gear Array.

Being an unarmed strike, Swarm Strike is already hideously competitive with the small investment of the Improved Unarmed Strike feat.

I don't think it needs Solar Weapon scaling.

I knew about it, but you need a feat to optimize that knack.

I dunno, when you need feats to make a clas feature decent, I sense a problem...

In starfinder, feats are just about the bottom tier selectable options for a character.

That a feat gives a nanocyte with swarm strike an incredibly powerful melee option that just about invalidates the other two arrays means that option is a touch overpowered, not underpowered. Honestly, if anything, it should have some ability to take weapon gear arrays up to the same level as swarm strike. Swarm strike is not a bad ability by any standard. It;s not a feat to make a class feature decent, it's a feat to make melee weapons outclassed for your character.

Milo v3 Jan 25, 2022, 04:48 pm

JiCi wrote:

I was aware of that, but this is the problem here.

A Major Form is not just a weapon. It can also be a cybernetic implant or technological item... that you might need to optimize your weapon. Since you cannot form more than 1 form per Gear Array, you have to settle for that item at one level and the weapon at another level.

The whole purpose of the Nanocyte is that you have a class that doesn't rely on "external hardware" to get around situations. However, it's so limited that it just comes out as a gimmick. The Gear Array has been pushed a LOT as the main feature of the Nanocyte, perhaps more than the Sheath and Cloud Arrays, yet it comes out of the weakest of them all.

The Nanocyte shouldn't need to manufactured weapons or tools. It should be able to whip out several forms at once at a decent level and mix and match. I can go as far as saying that Swarm Strike (available for the Sheath Array) should have been following the same damage progression as the Solarian Weapon, if a Nanocyte doesn't want to use the Gear Array.

At least the level aspect isn't actually an official limitation because of the RAW, it only affects what forms you have from level up rather than which 'forms you can form'. So you can do it if you have secondary arrays.

Wesrolter Jan 26, 2022, 03:58 am

4 people marked this as FAQ candidate.

Did this ever get FAQ'd. The sheath array as a second or third array, does the damage of the melee attack take the level hit to the damage?

Billion Sep 12, 2023, 05:57 pm

Hello, I want to re-create the Rev-9 Terminator from Dark Fate. I imagine a nanite alloy swirling over the frame or endoskeleton of a medium SRO. I loved how this was revealed in the movie when the mimetic polyalloy separated from the endoskeleton frame to form its own body. A two-in-one Terminator! Tech Revolution touches on this briefly with the Defensive Doppelganger knack at level 10 but it's not enough. The Cloud Array rules allow a "faintly visible cloud" that only becomes dense enough to provide concealment. The Nanoctye class needs a Drone Array or Separation Faculty that allows your nanites to split off of your body and perform actions. Can I use it to distract an opponent from behind? Can I use it to trap quarry I am chasing from two directions? Can it open a door for me from the other side? Can it jump from my vehicle to another and act independently? I will def homebrew this for myself but I'd like the developers at Paizo to take a crack at it and publish it in a farewell Starfinder Enhanced 2 book for First Edition.

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